Clutch Staying engaged

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Merc
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Clutch Staying engaged

Unread post by Merc » September 4th, 2010, 9:19 pm

I have a 1970 M151a2. Bear with me because I am quite new to engine's let alone Mutt's. I recently had to get my starter fixed because it wasn't pushing forward but would spin. Got that done and now the clutch is stuck. It starts up great and runs great. You can move the shifter into gear and out of gear just like if you were holding down the clutch but I am not. The clutch pedal has almost no pressure to it (the only pressure probably comes from the spring on the outside of the power pack). Is there something silly that I have missed? As for the starter all I did was take it off and put it on. Could it have done something? I searched and searched for a solution but couldn't find it. I have a feeling I am going to have to drop the tranny...


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http://www.flickr.com/photos/35531767@N07/3424484517/

199th mp
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Re: Clutch Staying engaged

Unread post by 199th mp » September 4th, 2010, 10:13 pm

at the end of the clutch actuator rod, there is a right angle bend that goes into a hole on the clutch lever, which is part of the clutch shaft assembly--is the rod still in the hole? i would give the linkage a good look, since removing the starter should not have affected the clutch. rickf is the real expert on these, he'll be back next week.

Fil Bonica
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Re: Clutch Staying engaged

Unread post by Fil Bonica » September 4th, 2010, 10:53 pm

If you peek at the clutch actuation assembly and follow it around you may find that something is broken , disconnected or worse just frozen together. Keep in mind the lever inside the bell housing that actuates the springs on the pressure plate may have come disconnected from its pivot.
If I were there I could be more helpful but these are some things to examine on your own.

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halftracknut
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Re: Clutch Staying engaged

Unread post by halftracknut » September 5th, 2010, 12:04 am

If the fingers on the pressure plate were very rusty when the clutch pedal was pushed down they could stick but is is very unlikely because of the strong pressure plate springs...Do you have the correct release rod...looks to be about 5/16 in dia. with a 90 degree leg on it ...leg end slips thru bell crank and spring hold it in place...sometimes I have seen this leg installed backwards and it binds up or drags bad against the bell housing... that may be your trouble and it has the pressure plate stuck..
slowest mutt east of the missippi..

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svramselaar
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Re: Clutch Staying engaged

Unread post by svramselaar » September 5th, 2010, 2:58 am

hello

if you take front drive shaft off
you can take the lower steel plate from the bell housing
maybe the exhaust pipe must also off
now you can see the clutch
see what happens inside

is the pressure plate stuck free
or is the pressure bearing to the front

george

Merc
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Re: Clutch Staying engaged

Unread post by Merc » September 5th, 2010, 10:49 pm

Wow, thank you everyone for your speedy and informative responses! The linkage is all good on the outside from the pedal to the transmission. And it has been running for about a year before the starter needed a new motor on it and I have had no problems until now. I will try to get the bell housing off like you suggested and see what I can find. Thanks again guys for everything. I will post what I find.

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Re: Clutch Staying engaged

Unread post by csmith » September 6th, 2010, 8:15 am

Welcome to the G8 Merc. As you can see there is a bunch of great guys (and gals) here with a lot of knowledge about 151's. Not a better place to be for this vehicle :!: Nice photos of your Mutt doing what they were built to do. :)
1976 M151A2 4 Color Cammo Mutt, aquired August 09
1976 or 7? M151A2 "Miss Sandy" Driver, aquired May 2010
Former owner M151A2 "Miss Saigon" Vietnam Rescue Sold Sept 09
Fond appreciation for the M151 Breed!!

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Re: Clutch Staying engaged

Unread post by halftracknut » September 6th, 2010, 10:32 am

I looked at your post again...and the only way you can move the shifter like that with the engine running is either the clutch is stuck somehow in the release position or the main shaft in your tranny is stripped or broke into...
slowest mutt east of the missippi..

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mrdibbles
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Re: Clutch Staying engaged

Unread post by mrdibbles » September 6th, 2010, 12:10 pm

Before I did anything else I'd remove and reinstall the starter. If the motor and clutch were fine before you replaced the starter then the simplest trouble shooting move would be to remove the two bolts to the starter, slide it out, and reinstall. I have installed a starter before that had the Bendix unit on the tip of it bind up on the flywheel. This didn't manifest itself with a clutch problem but it did make it so that the flywheel would not rotate (thus making the motor seem seized). Removed and reinstalled and there was no problem thereafter.
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Fil Bonica
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Re: Clutch Staying engaged

Unread post by Fil Bonica » September 6th, 2010, 4:52 pm

What happened to the starter and your current problem is unrelated.
In order to disengage the clutch you have to push in the pedal and that's it.
If there is a light touch to the pedal then there is a broken or missing spring.
there are only two springs associated with the clutch the external one and the ones associated with the pressure plate.
If the external clutch return spring is correct and in place then it can only be the pressure plate and its springs.
If you do as George says and remove the metal bell housing cover you could probably see the problem.

Good Luck

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Re: Clutch Staying engaged

Unread post by rickf » September 7th, 2010, 9:29 am

Well I am back but I don't really have anything to add that has not already been said. If I were to guess I would say the throwout bearing has jammed on the shaft or something was dropped in there when the starter was pulled and has gotten behind the clutch arm. That is a long shot since the starter is on the oppisite side from the arm but I have seen stranger things happen.


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Re: Clutch Staying engaged

Unread post by Merc » September 27th, 2010, 11:21 pm

Finally got around to removing the bell housing. Don't know exactly what I am looking for but it doesn't look like anything is out of place from the bell housing. SO, I will probably just have to pull the engine to get in there right?

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Re: Clutch Staying engaged

Unread post by M2HALFTRACKBOY » September 28th, 2010, 3:20 am

It's definitely time to go to an auto parts store and buy a small extendible mechanic's mirror Have a look up in there and see what position that yoke is in. First, is it where it should be? Second, is it stuck in the depressed position? That should tell you how big or small this fix is going to be.

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svramselaar
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Re: Clutch Staying engaged

Unread post by svramselaar » September 28th, 2010, 4:10 am

hello

you have the steel plate of from the bell housing ?

if you go under the mutt and a helper push the clutch pedal in
now the bearing must go to the front if he let the pedal go the bearing go back
if the pedal is back between the bearing and the three fingers must be a space
all fingers must have the same space if you turn the engine by hand (1 to 2 mm / 0,039 to 0,078 inch
is one finger or all in take the engine out the pressure plate assay is not good

to try a experiment you can not loose if you must take the engine out :idea:
take the spring from the clutch rod and take the rod from the lever
take the bolts tad hold the clutch together out now you can see more

george

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Re: Clutch Staying engaged

Unread post by ohiomgman » September 29th, 2010, 8:18 am

Several times I have found that the clutch disks can "attach itself" to the flywheel, via some rust. I have had to go under them with someone holding the clutch pedal down and tap/loosen the disk with a screwdriver until it would free up. Of course the clutch cover must be removed.

I have seen THAT more than once, especially, when they sit for an extended period.
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